Author Topic: All Womens Class  (Read 23198 times)

TODD

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #15 on: August 09, 2003, 11:02:06 PM »
I'm sorry but I do not see the difference of men vs. women as in the martial arts.  Size?  Power?
What about speed, technique, wisdom, aggressiveness, and seizing the moment?  Should men
only train with men?  How many studios out there can accomodate separation of the sexes?
Moreover should they?  I don't think so.  My 2 cents.

Offline Rock

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #16 on: August 10, 2003, 12:41:08 AM »
OK, I'd thought I throw in my two cents too.  
If you had a 'womens only' class such as an introductory course or for a limited time periord I would agree with the concept, however as for long term training, and for anyone to become well practiced in Kajukenbo, they need to practice against many different body types: big, small, heavy, light, men and women.

I also agree that if a woman trained in a "females only" class, they would be more comfortable and would be able to focus upon the techniques. However they also may become shocked or unwilling to defend themselves against a male attacker, more so if they have a history of abuse by a male. Personally seeing this first hand, the results is a victim who assumes the fetal position and mentally shuts down.

Sometimes the gender of the attacker can be more intimidating than their size. And it is that situation that can be addressed only in a mixed class setting.

Remember the class is to represent the real world. And nowadays I don't see anyplace that  is 100% women only. We train in the class because it is a safe and controlled environment, but it must be real enough so that we prepare ourselves for what is really out there.
Noel Araki
Hawaiian Kajukenbo Association
Mililani, Hawaii
www.hawaiiankajukenbo.com

Offline DACS

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #17 on: August 11, 2003, 05:53:05 AM »
Mell - If you follow your original plans of easing the students from the female class into a regular class, then it would serve it's purpose. I understand that there are people out there who are uncomfortable training with the opposite gender, and for that reason I will say that it is not a disservice to START in an all female class. If that is what it takes to break the ice for them, so be it. When my daughter wanted to learn to swim, I didn't just throw her into the deep end of the pool. I bought her arm floaters and started her in the shallow. She's graduated to the deep end now. I think some of us missed the part about the gradual movement into a regular class. However i do agree that it should be just for starters. That way you can slowly build up their confidence along with their skills, to be at least ready for a co-ed class. We were always taught that to conquer your fears, you must first face them. So if this class helps them ease into a regular class, then YES, it has value. As for a false sense of security, if they are too nervous or fear training with the opposite gender, then that would mean that they are not too secure to begin with. I would assume that they would know that training without men will not prepare them to defend against men...but it's still a start. I'm babbling, but I think my point was made.
Ramos Method
Wahiawa Kajukenbo

Offline Brandi Ross

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #18 on: August 11, 2003, 07:31:24 PM »
I agree with DACS.  To transition from one to another is probably the best way to go for some.  This will allow the women to have some sense of skill prior to entering the co-ed class.  I remember seeing somewhere that some schools even have two weeks of private lessons to transition one to the regular class.  Here, the student is getting introduced to what will go on down the line and what will help him/her get ready for regular class.  I feel it's good to have women's seminars at times.  This allows the instructor to concentrate more on the women and help them more in a smaller setting.  I remember a woman attended a seminar I was at and she broke down crying when we were doing bagwork.  She had been abused by her ex.  Her mindset was nowhere ready to attend a regular class with men.  Now, she can do it.  She has gone a step beyond her fears and is working to better herself.  I don't want to see anyone scared off from training.  If additional time or a separate class is needed in the start, then so be it.  We only have co-ed classes.  Yes, some are intimidated.  Those that want to learn will learn anywhere.  Some may need more help and we should give it to them.  All I want to finish with is if you do an all-women's class please preface with learn the basics and get ready for co-ed: it will help you even more.

Aloha,
brandi
Brandi Ross
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Offline Serene

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #19 on: August 11, 2003, 07:34:25 PM »
This has always been a discussion among many but very few are willing to speak of it. Many assume that women would prefer to be training with other women and men prefer to train with just men.

For Kajukenbo training there should not be a separation between male or female. However, if you are teaching a women's self-defense class (non-Kajukenbo) its fine but have a man be the uke'. The reason I say that is so that she may feel the "actual" fear of a stranger grabing or punching her.

When a man grabs a woman there is a different feeling that comes over and that is to survive! Women verses women does not bring that out.  Keep in mind I am taking nothing from a woman.

We have Kajukenbo women's self-defense techniques. The reason they are called "women's" techniques is not because they are only for women. The reason is because the techniques are more flowing. Women have a tendency to flow better and men have a tendency to be robotic.   The men in our school are taught these too.  

In summary for Kajukenbo training no separation between male and female.
A women's self-defense class/seminar (non Kajukenbo) have a male uke'.

There's my opinion. I hope it helps.

Soifua,
Sifu Serene Terrazas
Head Instructor
Terrazas Kajukenbo
American Canyon, Ca.

Offline Gints Klimanis

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #20 on: August 12, 2003, 03:15:17 PM »
>We have Kajukenbo women's self-defense >techniques.The reason they are called "women's" >techniques is not because they are only for women. >The reason is because the techniques are more >flowing. Women have a tendency to flow better and >men have a tendency to be robotic.  

Design factors other than flow should be considered.
I would prefer to steer away from incendiary discussion, but I'll risk that in order to discuss male/female issues.
Women generally have less athletic experience.
Women can be generally compared to men as shorter, lighter and with a lower upper body and hand strength.
Male muscle pound and female muscle pound are
the same even though women have fewer muscle pounds.  Many women garnish their nails, so while scratching eyes is effective, most finger, grabbing and punching techniques are not suited for the overall female population.


"We do not condone the use of a toilet seat as a deadly weapon"
Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo, 3rd Degree Black Belt Prof. Richard Lewis
Bono JKD/Kajukenbo, Prof. John Bono, San Jose, CA
Baltic Dog, Dog Brothers Martial Arts

kajutexan

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #21 on: August 12, 2003, 04:28:18 PM »
Gints this one I have to disagree with not all woman are made the same.    :P  I also know that all men are not made the same. There are women out there that would smoke men and I am using this word dominate them as well.  You can't tell the book by it's cover. There are men out there  that can't even defend themselves and they have been in the art.  If they took a woman's class they might at least defend themselves.

Muscle is not everything you only need so much pressure to break any bone in the body but there is also a thing called the brain where they can make you think  and use it against you.

 Ifyou use the proper technique you will go down no matter who you are.  I'll also let you know that my mother wears combat boots and can kick my butt and I'm 6'2 250.  

If you were at the seminar in Vallejo I don't think you would have said such a thing and I know you would not have said that to the ladies that were present.  

Sifu Kailee#52

Offline Mike Nagano

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #22 on: August 12, 2003, 04:45:49 PM »
I love reading everyone's responses.  I, myself, haven't posted anything in quite some time, but I do feel a bit of a need to come to Gints' defense (not that he needs it by any means).  I just don't think his response was meant to offend.  And no where in his response does he refer to it as fact that "all" women are made the same.  That's why he used words such as "generally" and "many" and "can be."

Overall, and I responded to this topic previously, I still feel there's nothing wrong with an all-women's class, as long as the goal/purpose for the people in that class is to participate in the co-ed class.  At least, as DACS and triwahine mentioned, it would be an acceptable transition.
Sifu Mike Nagano
Bishop's Kajukenbo Academy

Offline Serene

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #23 on: August 12, 2003, 05:39:57 PM »
Greetings Everyone:

Let's see where to begin? Honestly, the first thought that comes to mind is to ream Gints over the coles. ;)

But can not because this is not that kind of forum.  ;D So, I will take my second choice and that is to explain our womens self-defense techniques again.

Yes they flow and they do not require any muscle strengh but they are very effective. We call them E.S.D. which stands for Escape, Shock and Destroy. They are common sense techniques. By no means are our techniques for women to square up to any man but for her to live to speak about it another day.

Yes, Gints mentioned "generally" and "many" in his post.
In addition, if you noticed Gints mentioned that he knew that he was taking a risk on giving his opinion. So the comments following are the risks that he took by posting his oppinion as we all do.  ;)

What a great topic! I give it to Gints for being straight forward.  :D Sometimes writing is not good enough. Therefore, Gints has just earned an invite to our school. If you would like to come and train with us our classes are on Tues/Thurs 7p.m.-9p.m. we are located at 974 Benicia Road, Vallejo, Ca.

If you need directions email me and I will gladly provide them to you. Your in San Jose, Ca. right? I believe that's about an hour away.  :D

Take care and thanks for your comments. 8)


Soifua,

 
Sifu Serene Terrazas
Head Instructor
Terrazas Kajukenbo
American Canyon, Ca.

sigungjoe

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #24 on: August 12, 2003, 08:34:13 PM »
as with anything, self defense techniques depend on the individual whether they are male or female. no one technique will work the same for everyone. I have some students that are huge. 6'4 300 lbs. that are fluid as a hula practitioner. and i have small students that are 5'6 125 lbs. and they are stiff as a board. the main thing to remember is that whether they are female, or male, the technique should fit the individual, and not the gender. Besides, if all females hit like Serene, Ide rather fight against large males. ;D Just my humble opinion.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2003, 08:37:21 PM by sigungjoe »

Offline Gints Klimanis

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #25 on: August 13, 2003, 06:59:12 PM »
I'm sorry if I ruffled some feathers.  While most people understood that I described generalizations, others countered the generalizations with exceptions.  Time and time again, it's seems that generalizations are often confused with absolutes.  Below I've listed some
more generalizations, along with examples of exceptions and some references.

I stand by my statements privately or publicly.  If I've written anything that you consider to be untrue, please educate me.

1) General:Men on average are taller than women.
Women on average are shorter than men.

Exception:  I know a short man.  I know a tall woman.

Reference:
Average height and weight charts
http://www.halls.md/chart/height-weight.htm

2) General : Men on average are heavier than women. Likewise, women on average are lighter than men.

Exception:  I know a 100 lb skinny guy.  I know a 250
lb mother.

Reference:
Average height and weight charts
http://www.halls.md/chart/height-weight.htm

"We do not condone the use of a toilet seat as a deadly weapon"
Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo, 3rd Degree Black Belt Prof. Richard Lewis
Bono JKD/Kajukenbo, Prof. John Bono, San Jose, CA
Baltic Dog, Dog Brothers Martial Arts

Offline Serene

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #26 on: August 13, 2003, 07:05:47 PM »
The bottom line is it doesn't matter weight, size or sex. It's all in the technique of defending one self.

The person that will survive will be the one with common sense, technique and the will to survive. Those three aspects are very anyone and everyone to achieve.

Soifua,
Sifu Serene Terrazas
Head Instructor
Terrazas Kajukenbo
American Canyon, Ca.

Offline Gints Klimanis

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #27 on: August 13, 2003, 07:10:25 PM »
Kailee,

I'm sorry if you read my post with an eye toward an incendiary tone.  My writing is dry and generally uncasual even though I have fun typing.

>You can't tell the book by it's cover.

You can't specifically judge the content of a book by its cover.  However, if covers weren't useful for identifying the contents of a book, books would be sold coverless.
That's why I think it's good to discuss generalizations.
I don't include them to slight women.  I reread my post.
Perhaps you should do the same and decide if you disagree with the content of each assertion.  

May I ask, do you believe that long, garnished finger nails interfere with the execution of punching and finger grasping techniques?
 


"We do not condone the use of a toilet seat as a deadly weapon"
Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo, 3rd Degree Black Belt Prof. Richard Lewis
Bono JKD/Kajukenbo, Prof. John Bono, San Jose, CA
Baltic Dog, Dog Brothers Martial Arts

Offline Gints Klimanis

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #28 on: August 13, 2003, 07:18:23 PM »
Thank you for the invitation, Serene.  I've met Prof. Bautista and would like to travel to visit your school someday.  The San Francisco Bay Area has many martial arts schools, and I'd like to visit as many as I can.

Likewise, I'd like to invite you to my club.
http://home.att.net/~gints/home.htm

This is a primarily weapons sparring club that I run separately from with my primary Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo school in Sunnyvale, CA with Master Richard Lewis.  Most of the pictures are kinda old, keep checking the site for fresh ones.  You can identify me by checking the Fighter's page.  


"We do not condone the use of a toilet seat as a deadly weapon"
Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo, 3rd Degree Black Belt Prof. Richard Lewis
Bono JKD/Kajukenbo, Prof. John Bono, San Jose, CA
Baltic Dog, Dog Brothers Martial Arts

Offline Serene

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Re:All Womens Class
« Reply #29 on: August 13, 2003, 07:51:41 PM »
Gints:

Thank you for the invite. My invite to you was so that you may obtain a better understanding of men and women training together.

Therefore, I beleive it would be in your benefit to come to our school so you can see first hand.

At our school are techniques contain boxing, grabing, forms, clubs, knives, guns, kicking, choking, 2,3 &4 attacks, advanced punch counters, bull ring, hand conditioning and so on. We are your ol'Kajukenbo dojo.

Soifua,
Sifu Serene Terrazas
Head Instructor
Terrazas Kajukenbo
American Canyon, Ca.