Author Topic: Master of Kajukenbo?  (Read 23326 times)

Offline rockatear

  • Blue Belt
  • ***
  • Posts: 320
  • "Study your teacher carefully", Professor Bones
    • JustThink.Us
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #45 on: September 17, 2005, 12:32:46 PM »
Thanks Sigung Mark :).  I'll past it along to him.

with respect,
Shirley Phelps, blue blelt, Hand to Hand Kajukenbo Self-Defense Center, Oakland, CA, www.handtohandkajukenbo.com, Gaylord Method, Chief Head Instructors:  Sifus Jen Resnick and Sonya Richardson

Offline ZDawson

  • White Belt
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #46 on: September 17, 2005, 01:29:13 PM »
It seems that all the answers fall around the perception of the word “Master”.  Master is one of those outstanding English words that have more meanings than letters.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=master 
and the Japanese is no better:
http://poets.notredame.ac.jp/cgi-bin/jedi
Let’s see what may apply:
【主】 [あるじ] master/head (of a household)/landlord/one's husband/employer/host
Every time I walked into a new school I show respect to the owner of the school as the master. So I have met 50 to 100 masters.
【旧師】 [きゅうし] (n) one's old teacher/one's old master
Defining old may be touchy. Over 60 years old. 10 to 15
【手利き】 [てきき] (n) skill/mastery
This is not very helpful. Defines itself;
【修める】 [おさめる] (v1) (1) to study/to complete (a course)/to cultivate/to master/(2) to order (one's life)/(3) to repair (a fault one has committed)
darn; again not helpful.
【上忍】 [じょうにん] (n) Ninja clan master/highest-ranking Ninja
Met a guy once that said he was this? Who knows?
【先生】 [せんせい] (n) teacher/master/doctor
A couple of these.
【大師範】 [だいしはん] (n) master/grandmaster/senior instructor
Dozens of these.
【武芸者】 [ぶげいしゃ] (n) master of martial arts
And we come to a point; I think; humans make up concepts; then words in order to structure there world. As with almost everything in life it comes down to relativity and perspective. Would a master of the martial arts today be considered a master 200 years ago?   They had challenge fights to the death to test there skills. One persons master is another’s student. I have started with an instructor that I considered a master, after years of study my world opened to find others with much greater skill. Did my original instructor become less of a master? When my skills became greater than my instructor does that make me a master? I feel that I have mastered nothing in my life. I have not met anyone who has mastered anything in there lives. At best I’ve met people who where really darn good at what they where doing. I think at best the word “master” is a floating concept that keeps us moving towards improving ourselves through the teaching of others.

Wow, that was fun. I have too much time on my hands.
Zen Dawson
Kempo

Offline rockatear

  • Blue Belt
  • ***
  • Posts: 320
  • "Study your teacher carefully", Professor Bones
    • JustThink.Us
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #47 on: September 17, 2005, 05:50:07 PM »
ZDawson,

It sounds as if you're saying no one can be a master as in,
Quote
"I think at best the word “master” is a floating concept that keeps us moving towards improving ourselves through the teaching of others."
  I apply such concepts to the word, "perfect", as I don't think anybody's perfect since we are human beings and by our very nature we make mistakes.   OTOH, I think one can be a master and indeed is entitled to the honor, respect and privileges of being so.  By honor and respect I mean recognition that their title "master" means they worked very hard to attain the achievements that are required for a master, and by privileges I mean not taking issue with what they say or do about their art as to go out of my way to try and prove them wrong just because I differ from their viewpoint.  Too, that until proven different, that I pretty much will take what they say about the art and my training at face value.  By proven different that would mean some legitimate organization has said that person has been dishonorable and is no longer recognized as an honorable member.  Or, I could be around a person with the title of master and nothing about them by their actions verifies they are indeed a master. For me, master is more than just physical skills.  It is also the embodyment of knowledge and spirituality of character and the respect they give to others regardless of rank or privilege.

Of course there are exceptions to all rules, even to a member who once was acknowledged as a master and no longer is for whatever reason.  If I personally knew that person then I would have to make up my own mind whether I still considered him or her a master.

with respect,
Shirley Phelps, blue blelt, Hand to Hand Kajukenbo Self-Defense Center, Oakland, CA, www.handtohandkajukenbo.com, Gaylord Method, Chief Head Instructors:  Sifus Jen Resnick and Sonya Richardson

Offline Sifu Julian

  • Senior Black Belt
  • Yellow Belt
  • ***
  • Posts: 74
  • Civilize the Mind, Make Savage the Body!
    • Chinese Kajukenbo Self-Defense
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #48 on: September 21, 2005, 01:55:42 PM »
Prof. Mitch,

Well, here I go skipping the pan and going straight to the fire!  :-)

To begin, as I read through the first page of this thread I wondered where it was going and then about page 2 you began to show where you were going.

Here is some background:
Prof. Alan Carter was promoted to black belt through 3rd degree by GM Sid Asuncion. Alan (he has asked me repeatedly to refer to him this way, so please don't think this disrespectful) then left HI in 1970 at the end of his military tour. So, Kajukenbo in the Midwest has survived in a vacuum from then until 1997 when Prof. Carter made contact with GM George Iversen, who was the Asst. Chief when Alan was promoted. In 1997 Alan was promoted to 7th and then to 8th in 2001.

So, Prof. Mitch, when you listed the techniques that you teach at your school---we don't know a portion of those because our Kajukenbo is mid-to-late 60's and does not have the material added since that time. So here is a breakdown of our curiculum:

1. Forms 1 through 8
2. Punch Defenses 1 through 20
3. Grabs 1 through 10
4. Knife and Club Defenses 1 through 5
5. Take Downs and Adlibs
6. Bo staff, Escrima sticks, or Sword.
Which Includes:
30 Hand Techniques
18 Kicking Techniques
16 Blocking Techniques
16 Stances
500 hours of Teaching Experience
& Board Breaking

So, the formal 2-mans, 3-mans, and Alphabets we never got because they were a later addition, as I understand it.

So, now to answer the question: Both Prof. Carter and Prof. Doug Washburn are masters of "original" Kajukenbo (if I can use that term without offense) meaning what Prof Carter brought with him in 1970. 

Again, I agree with you, Prof. Mitch, about rating in the given areas (i.e. KA-JU-KEN-BO). I would definitely say that in the Midwest we tend toward being masters of KA, KEN, & BO. At 5th my Judo/Jujitsu is not good, or at least not as good as I want it to be in this age of MMA & BJJ. This, IMHO, is due to GM Asuncion's strengths in those same areas, which when he founded his own system he called it KEN-KA-BO with no JU in it.

Alan's greatest strength is his self-defense/defensive tactics material. Prof. Mitch, you mentioned guys that hit hard---GM Iversen said that he has 3 or 4 people he thinks of when the subject of hitting hard/hard hands comes up and here are just a couple of the names I can remember: Prof. Chow, GM Ed Parker Sr., and Alan Carter. Having personally trained with Alan over the past 6+ years (when I am in the US) I never cease to be amazed and challenged to think more critically and tactically about my self-defense material. The pain Alan can inflict in one pricisely placed hit is almost inconceiveable and yet he looks to a by-stander as if he is just playing patty-cake with you.

Prof. Washburn has added a lot of Wing Chun into his expression of Kajukenbo. His Chi Sao is great and I consider it an honor to have worked that with him in May this year.

Prof. Washburn's senior student, Sifu Charlie Walton is another name I would place on that list. I have a video of Sifu Charlie doing all 8 of our forms and he is as precise as anyone I have ever seen. At 5th he definitely is a master of the technical material.

I have always been told that 1st -5th degrees are the technical side of the arts (or what you get from the arts) and that 6th - 9th are the teaching and administrative side of the arts (or what you give back to the arts). That is not to say that a 6th doesn't improve in his technical skill (of course they do) but that the focus of their skills moves toward breaking down the material into simplier part so that downline students can grasp it more easily.

This is where my promoting instructor, Sigung Charlie Clarke, comes in. He is a master of breaking things down for students that are having trouble learning a particular technique. He is a great example of a teacher of incredible humility and character.

So, there is a long answer to a short question. I see all of my instructors as Master of Kajukenbo but, like the rest of us, they have their area of personal preference and excellence. Just because they are masters of a given set of throws & locks does not mean they are masters of Judo/Jujitsu and similar comparisons could be made to the other arts.
I also agree that Kajukenbo is so diverse across the 4 recognized branches and the 2 sub-methods (Gaylord & Ramos) that it is very difficult to compare a Tum Pai Black Sash, a Chu'an Fa Black Sash, and a Kenpo Method Black Belt. Having a "core" of techniques would help to give a basis of comparison across all the branches and methods.

I completely agree that we are all always students and growing in our understanding of technical material, teaching technique, personal development, and self-awareness. I like Sigung Bishop's quote: "Time with either expose you or promote you!"

Prof. Mitch, I would also be interested in getting a copy of the Alphabet Manual you mentioned in General Techniques.

Mahalo & Aloha!

J.
Professor Julian Sims
8th Red Belt/Black Border-Kajukenbo Self-Defense;
4th Red & White Belt-Bushido Kempo;
3rd Black Sash-SDS Jeet Kune Do;
3rd Degree Instructor-Chinese Wushu Assn.;
K.S.D.I. #837
K.O.A.-Sifu Society
O.K.O.-Lifetime #139

Offline badsifu

  • restricted
  • Brown Belt
  • ****
  • Posts: 971
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #49 on: September 21, 2005, 11:19:04 PM »
So, Prof. Mitch, when you listed the techniques that you teach at your school---we don't know a portion of those because our Kajukenbo is mid-to-late 60's and does not have the material added since that time.

The techniques listed by Professor Powell are the Original Hard Style as taught in Palama.  If not, then all us Reyes lineage folks have been doing way too much all this time ;)  If that is what you are referring to anyways.
Dan Tyrrell

Offline Sifu Julian

  • Senior Black Belt
  • Yellow Belt
  • ***
  • Posts: 74
  • Civilize the Mind, Make Savage the Body!
    • Chinese Kajukenbo Self-Defense
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #50 on: September 23, 2005, 12:25:20 PM »
Aloha,
Most of the early pioneers that relocated to America via Hawaii did not come with the entire Kajukenbo (Emperado Method) system as we know today. The Ramos’, Gaylord’s and Habuna’s systems are similar to the original method but are different. The late GM Reyes brought the entire package.
As laid out by Sifu Julian, the aforementioned curriculum was what GM Sid Asuncion had already gained before he started his school. I am from GM Asuncion’s lineage and unfortunately we were not instructed in the 26 Alphabets, forms 9-14, and other techniques that completed the entire hard style system.

GM Asuncion was one of the first Kajukenbo pioneers in Hawaii and he has 8 Grandmasters and 16 Professors under his family tree.

Prof. Gerry,

Thanks for that historical perspective! I wasn't sure if that missing material was across the Asuncion Clan or if that was just us in the Midwest. I would be interested to hear more about that from you personally (in an e-mail or whatever you have time for) to gain a deeper understanding into what makes the Asuncion Clan unique.

Mahalo!

J.
Professor Julian Sims
8th Red Belt/Black Border-Kajukenbo Self-Defense;
4th Red & White Belt-Bushido Kempo;
3rd Black Sash-SDS Jeet Kune Do;
3rd Degree Instructor-Chinese Wushu Assn.;
K.S.D.I. #837
K.O.A.-Sifu Society
O.K.O.-Lifetime #139

Offline Eugene Sedeno

  • Moderator
  • Blue Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 203
  • Teacher
    • Sedeno's School of Self-Defence
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #51 on: October 02, 2005, 09:46:16 PM »
Aloha Prof. Powell,

First of all I apologize for taking so long to respond to your question.  My job had me out of the state for a while and I was away from the web.

Your choices are excellent and well thought out.  I’m sure different people with different experiences and teachers will have different choices.  That said……………

From my personal training experiences I would have to mention:

Professor Walter Godin because of his mastery of the system and his ability to both explain and perform the techniques.  He also was able to use them in the streets of Honolulu on several occasions, I observed a couple of these “demonstrations”.  He also trained many champions like John Hackleman and Martin Buell.

GM Sid Asuncion because his immense speed and power.  He was smaller then me, you know how little I am, yet he could hit you with either hand and knock you on your okole or out!  When he closed his hands you would see at least 16 darkened knuckles staring at you.  When you worked out with him it was like getting hit by machine gun bullets.   He, like all on this list was also a good teacher and able to explain techniques and concepts in a way that was understandable.  A good tactician both standing and on the ground.

GM Brother Abe Kamahoahoa was a mountain of a man.  He was Professor Chows top man before joining Sijo and the KSDI.  Another very fast and super powerful man.  As big as he was he was still able to bounce on his toes and use angles in his movements.  To give you an idea of how powerful and focused he was, he could just pick up a brick and break it.  No wind-up, no deep breaths, no kiai.  He would just break it effortlessly.  The way a martial artist is supposed to effortlessly take out there opponent in a life and death situation.

I know I said to not use Sijo or Prof. Chow but I was in training classes with them in the 1960’s and I can say from first hand experience that they are the real deal.  How they moved and their technique was amazing.

Master Rick Alemany was and still is a master of movement and technique.  He is a champion tournament competitor who also knows how to switch gears for a real fight.  He has the unique ability to communicate the technical aspects of the art and perform them effortlessly yet effectively.

GM Ted Sotelo………………….nuff said!

I hope this answers your question as well as you answered mine.  I too am sure I left many people off my list, not on purpose.  The world is getting smaller all the time and I'm sure we will meet and train with others that we would add to our lists.

Good luck on your upcoming trip to China.

Eugene Sedeño
GM Eugene Sedeno
9th DBB
Perpetual Student

Offline WmBall

  • White Belt
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • "Once they go down they dont get back up" -JSH
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #52 on: October 04, 2005, 09:25:29 PM »
When I joind the KSDI in 1980 there was only a couple schools on the west coast if i remember right.. in the then west coast association, one in pacifica ran by then Prof. Halbuna and one i believe in socal. I'm not sure who ran that one. I trained under Joe Halbuna and even back then i belive he was a true master of the art.

He sure trained a hardcore class and when he tested you, boy you knew it was a test. I saw many a young sidai fall out and have to re-test later. But he also had a genuine air about him that could light up a room and he took great pleasure in little things like making trophys for local tourny's. If i had a nickle for every hour I spent with him just making trophys or flipping mat's.. well,  I couldnt be any richer then what just spending that qualty one on one time with him made me.

What also made him so great was how much he truly loved to share and teach and how proud he was of his students, I always rode with him to tournys in the bay area and I cant remember a single time i competed in any event when i didnt at some point catch a glimps of him just beaming at me with so much pride that you could see it on his face from a mile away. It gave you so much confidence that it not only made you a better artist but it made you a better person and it wasnt just with me, he was like that with all his students and we were all better for it.

He was truly a master, not just of his art but of life and of good will.... Well, tune in next time and I'll tell you about the 82 class trip to Honolulu.
William Ball
Kajukenbo Self Defence Institute
Pacific Coast Association Pacifica Ca
SGM Joseph Halbuna 1980-1984

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #53 on: October 04, 2005, 09:36:55 PM »
SGM Joe Halbuna was a great man, very nice to everyone, he was one of many with school during that time period.  The bay area had one of the biggest concentrations of Kaju schools anywhere. The list is long, Gaylord, Ramos, Reyes, Dacascos all had schools affiliated with them in the bay area...
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline rockatear

  • Blue Belt
  • ***
  • Posts: 320
  • "Study your teacher carefully", Professor Bones
    • JustThink.Us
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #54 on: October 05, 2005, 12:50:18 AM »
I had the pleasure of interacting with SGM Halbuna a couple of times when my older son, in his early and mid-teens was big on tournaments and it seemed almost every Saturday we were somewhere at a tournament.  I was not practicing martial arts at the time although I did spend a lot of time practicing lying, sitting, and sleeping on bleachers :D.  Anyway, at one of the tournaments, my son won the grand prize for his division and he had this trophy almost as big as him and two more and I remember how generous SGM Halbuna was with his time, taking a pic with just my son, then taking a pic with my son, husband, and me and then taking one with my son's very first teacher (he started at 4 years old), Sifu Eva and my son.  His spirit was as beautiful as the smile in his eyes.  Then at another tournament he took this huge picture on the floor with my son's school and my son's teacher's teacher's school, which still sits in Sifu Solis' office.  And finally, at one tournament he was selling some t-shirts and I remember just enjoying spending the time talking and bargaining with him...he only had about 4 shirts left and I probably only had about $15 bucks and I ended up with the 4 shirts.

To me, it is not enough that the great teachers are knowledgeable and expert in the mastery of their art.  It is mostly their spirit and character and how they interact with others, especially on the small stuff.  The great teachers are always listening so they really hear what it is and isn't that we are saying and they are not only gracious with sharing their time, but with sharing themselves.

with respect,
Shirley Phelps, blue blelt, Hand to Hand Kajukenbo Self-Defense Center, Oakland, CA, www.handtohandkajukenbo.com, Gaylord Method, Chief Head Instructors:  Sifus Jen Resnick and Sonya Richardson

Palma

  • Guest
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #55 on: April 12, 2006, 10:58:58 PM »
This is a reference regarding "Masters" and not to anyone master in the Kajuembo system, but in any martial arts.
I recall as a young man watching Royce Gracie take on a "master" by the name of Ron Van Clief. Ron "The Black Dragon" Van Clief is a martial arts legend. Born in Brooklyn, New York in 1943, he started martial arts training in his early teens. At 5 feet 10 inches and 190 pounds, Van Clief was fast, powerful, and tough. He won 10 New York State Full-Contact Karate Championships. He won multiple Karate Point-Fighting Titles. By the early 1970s he had earned his 10th Degree Black Belt. His karate record was reported to be 110-8. In 1994 at age 51.

This guy was an idol for me when I was growing up, but after seeing Royce beat him in second I really thought about people referring to themselves as "masters". I feel that any man can be beaten by any man. I once witnessed a good friend of mine who was a very skilled Kajukenbo artist get his asp handed to him by a non-martial arts practicioner in a fight. I think that the word "master" gives off a sense of invincibility and I think that this is wrong.

This is just my opinion.

Offline Sifu Sin Bin

  • Holy Cow, I am a
  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 1391
  • YOU SUCK, TRAIN HARDER
    • check it out
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #56 on: April 13, 2006, 11:42:50 PM »
That is the truest statement I have read in a long time, Thanks Palma 8)
Professor Rob Peladeau
8th Degree - KSDI #672
Loyal Student and lifelong friend of
Grand Master Emil Bautista
NorCal Headquarters of K.S.D.I. Ambassador

Palma

  • Guest
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #57 on: April 14, 2006, 03:37:58 AM »
Thanks Sifu Bin

Offline David Earl

  • White Belt
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #58 on: November 15, 2006, 07:17:46 PM »
GM Angel Garcia was here recently, and i was lucky enough to have him attend one of our classes. He delivered, in a very short time, so much information that I am still sitting here reviewing what he showed us weeks later. It was an honor and a priviledge!
Melas Kajukenbo
Oakland, Ca.

Offline Al Saddler

  • BlackBelt
  • Blue Belt
  • ***
  • Posts: 319
Re: Master of Kajukenbo?
« Reply #59 on: November 16, 2006, 12:32:02 PM »
It was an honor to have him in your class David. Not many people are fortunate enough to have him not only attend but to teach as well. The best thing was that there weren't 50 people standing around asking "how'd that go". We all do that every single time.

You will remain confused for quite some time. His movements and body postures are different than what we are used to in standard Kajukenbo. Review the footage that you have and watch the footwork and how he closes distances and so forth. Soon enough at least that part will click. 

David, please list you affiliation when you get a chance (name of school).
Al Saddler
Powell's MMA Academy