Author Topic: Handling a Grappler  (Read 26381 times)

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #30 on: September 28, 2004, 02:21:14 PM »
pic
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #31 on: September 28, 2004, 02:21:25 PM »
pic
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline Wado

  • BlackBelt
  • Brown Belt
  • ****
  • Posts: 529
  • llama llama
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #32 on: September 28, 2004, 03:25:20 PM »
Thanks, good stuff Sigung Bono. I still remember years ago when you came up to Seattle with Sigung Yoshi, and showed us some of this stuff.

Question, the guy on the bottom placed his left fingers on the thumb side of his right arm to try to avoid the armbar the first time. You struck his hand. The question is, was that defense verse the armbar harder to deal with than the more conventionally taught left fingers on pinky side of right arm? Did it make a difference?
W. Yamauchi
Mateo Kajukenbo
Seattle, Washington

Offline Mitch Powell

  • Senior Black Belt
  • Brown Belt
  • ***
  • Posts: 820
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #33 on: September 28, 2004, 04:10:29 PM »
Sigung Bono,
Here's something that I'd like for you to kick around if you will. Anyone who knows you, knows you are versed in both standing and ground fighting. Now, if you could pick just one fighting style which would it be and why?

Also, much has been said over the last few years about fighters who fail to add grappling skills-especially since the Gracie family hit the scene. What about the flip side to that, those ground fighters who don't strike or kick?

You have skills in both areas. Can you comment on what you would want a ground fighter to learn about striking and kicking, and what you think a striker needs to know about ground fighting?
Powell's MMA Academy (KSDI#549)
Grandmaster Mitch Powell (Emperado Method)
(707) 344-1655  coachmitchpowell@hotmail.com

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #34 on: September 28, 2004, 04:28:54 PM »
Wado, It makes no difference in that case.  His best defense would have been the finger lock position, like two fists holding each other.  Your tendons have incredicle strength in comparison to a defense using the muscle as is in the photo.  he wasn't a grppler and did what most everyone does in that situation. There are many ways to break his hold, I chose the  four knuckle punch for the pain factor...it was a Kaju seminar... hope that makes sense... GungBono
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline V. F. Mateo

  • Senior Black Belt
  • Blue Belt
  • ***
  • Posts: 170
  • That little extra in ordinary = extraordinary
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #35 on: September 28, 2004, 04:39:58 PM »
Good questions, Professor Powell. Nice job Sifu Wado!
I've meet Sigung Bono twice in the years with GM Gaylord's group & Sigung Yoshi.

Howzit brah... 8)
I remember Sigung Bono, Sigung Yoshi, GM Gaylord, myself, and Sigung John were sitting around the table. He applied a reverse choke hold on me, I tried hard to escape and scrape my fingers on his watch. Brother is very strong. He knows his stuff. What Wado says about breathing is an important factor when being choked. How would one train to sustain one's breathing and counter? Of course, some guys who are older would prefer to do stand up. :)

Aloha to you Sigung Bono
V. Frank Mateo-8th degree; GM Gerry Scott
CHA 3 Kenpo Karate; retired Co-Founder Frank Suan
5th Degree KAA; GGM Charles Gaylord-Professor Brian Yoshii & Professor Brian Baxter
Ali'i Warriors Fight Club-Muay Thai (Promoter, Match Maker, Trainer, and Coach)

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #36 on: September 28, 2004, 04:58:54 PM »
Frank, We practice this at our school. you have someone you know and likes you, put you in a choke. You take very tiny multiple breaths in and out, deep breaths will knock you out.  As you take these breaths you attempt to turn your hips towards the attacker on the side of the arm that is choking you.  We say turn towards their bicep. eventually turning to hug them.  If they are to good, you pace your breathing to keep the blood flowing.  I have many students, children (Marco, Ivan, Little Eddie) and Esther for instance that will stay in position till you are to tired to hold the move ...and then of course...They get you......
« Last Edit: September 28, 2004, 08:54:23 PM by KajuJKDFighter »
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #37 on: September 28, 2004, 04:59:10 PM »
pic
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #38 on: September 28, 2004, 04:59:19 PM »
pic
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #39 on: September 28, 2004, 04:59:32 PM »
pic
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #40 on: September 28, 2004, 04:59:43 PM »
pic
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #41 on: September 28, 2004, 05:24:04 PM »
Professor Powell,
  This is a very tough one I have contemplated many, many times.  The trick to this question is, can I add to the style, can I use "No way as Way", I like to be like the chameleon and adapt an steal when ever I can. If I see you teach something I can use or even modify to use, I do and tell my students, "I saw Professor Mitch do this and this is how we are going to use it".  I started in kenpo and boxing as a kid and then jujitsu, knives, kickboxing, chin na, and so on, then as I searched for what I was looking for I found Kaju and Jeet Kune Do, both very open minded arts, which allow you to add what is needed to win. My main instructors Yoshii, Gaylord and Hartsell always encouraged adding what is useful.  I tell new students we use a base of Kajukenbo, because no one I have seen has the toughness and heart the true Kaju guys/gals have.  The JKD has a great deal of skills in it, and the philosophy of fighting is very great and realistic, but the toughness, is individual there.  I can take a great striker and make him good grappler in no time but it is much more difficult to take a grappler and train him for the standup.  We have had Many grapplers come to my school and roll.  Most pure grapplers go into shock mode when they are hit and that's their limiting factor. Though stand up fighting has in reality few techniques and the grappling arts literally thousands.  I think the grappling is more natural for people once they get down there and try it, and just easier to learn. It's like the old saying, "Everyone has a plan and then they get punched in the face."  I like to chose the situation in a fight ....if there is alot of them strike with fury, if one in a field a take down can control the fighter and make it easier to decide how much damage you want to cause.  We train regularly with multiple fighters on the ground, and a good striker with good grappling skills can take out three or so fighters, if he has the heart for it.
   A ground fighter needs to earn low line kicks, and boxing skills from someone that truly knows how to punch and defend at the same time.  Let's say someone that has had that punch in the face.  A striker needs to be able to get a feel for the take down and balancing to stop it.  If you strike at a guy who's a great leg shooter you will in all likely hood will be on your back. (Remember, lots of people have had high school wrestling..how many had high school martial arts, or boxing...almost none.  I hear many say they would knock them out on the way in, but I wonder how many people they Have actually ever knocked out in their life...probably none...so why would it happen under the stress of an attack.  You perform how you train in a fight.   Positioning on the ground is important and leverage, you need to be able to get off the bottom first an foremost.  I see strikers get mounted all the time and their feet go straight up in the air...just like a bird that fell off the perch, death or a beating is sure to follow.  I'll stop for now but I hope this sort of answers your questions, leave it to you to give me such a tough one  thanks, it made me think...Sigung Bono  

PS, you really need to have these....
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline Claudio

  • BlackBelt
  • Blue Belt
  • ***
  • Posts: 313
  • Empty your mind
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #42 on: September 29, 2004, 01:37:19 PM »
Great response Sigung Bono

I train at the Norcal fighting Alliance, a Cesar Gracie affiliate NHB school. No GI. It's in Sant Rosa run by David Terrell.

Anyway, my students and I also train with takedowns while applying strikes and it's very difficult to get that one punch knockout or get a timed punch in when you don't know when the takedown is coming. Leg kicks add an entire new element to the ballgame. I find that the viciousness of kajukembo helps out quite a bit during training.

One thing I did want to add, is to all kajukenbo/kajukembo instructors a good NHB fighter is very hard to beat. The idea of a grappler trying to pull guard in a street fight and then you hitting them in the groin with strikes and ending the fight everytime is a little far fetched. Eye pokes are fine until you get caught in an armbar. The grappler wants to be on top also and pound there opponent into the ground,so the more you train in grappling whether it's BJJ, GJJ or Sambo for leg and ankle (breaks)which I also like. The better Kaju martialist you'll be.

Kajukenbo/Kajukembo is the Heat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Prof. Claude "Claudio" Lawson III
Ronin Kombat Systems / American Kajukembo Assoc

Kajukembo/Kajukenbo(GM Davis)/ Brazilian Jiujitsu/Kick Boxing/ Practical Weapons/ JKD

Offline KajuJKDFighter

  • Senior Moderator
  • Black Belt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3442
  • "Accept the things to which fate binds you"
    • Bono's Jeet Kune Do and Kajukenbo
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #43 on: September 29, 2004, 02:33:51 PM »
We are also a no gi school and it is a rare occasion that you get that one punch in hard enough for a knockout.  We use eye pokes as an entry and they are great against an inexperienced fighter, but once again we train to keep ourselves out of harms way by neutralizing the arms from that type of attack.  Long range Thai or savate type kicks are very effective also at slowing down your opponent.  You just need to be realistic in your approach to your training of what happens in a Real fight and how you can over come it.  Train for the biggest, meanest, fastest, most talented fighter you can think of and then the regular guy will be easy.  Pick someone you know or make up a fictional character to use in your mind as the opponent you are training for.  MMA-Kaju baby...SJEBDC
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline sifu_adam

  • BlackBelt
  • Yellow Belt
  • **
  • Posts: 53
  • Kajukenbo Alive in Colorado!
    • Loveland Martial Arts Academy
Re:Handling a Grappler
« Reply #44 on: September 29, 2004, 03:30:09 PM »
"Know your enemy"
and
not every situation is going to call for a Life or Death defense.

In our Kaju academy you are required to learn both Kajukenbo and Judo(40 throws and ALL ground work) in order to recieve your 1st Degree Black.
9 years ago I added Brazilian Jiu Jitsu (directly under the Gracie Academy) training to my Kajukenbo/Judo. I went from just competing in karate, kickboxing and traditional Judo to add all types of submission wrestling and BJJ tournament under my belt. In addtition to my 4th Degree in Kajukenbo and Judo, I am ranked in BJJ directly under the Gracie Family. I don't add to the Kaju or Judo, but show other options and ideas that come from the BJJ training. IF you really look into and KNOW a COMPLETE Judo program there is a large amount of ground fighting locks and chokes. Judo is already fantastic if you are under the right instruction of a real Judo player. To add BJJ just adds another set of options for positions you may find yourself in a fight.
 
Judo and Jiu Jitsu are imporant to keep sharp in todays times, we must also realize all the legal issues that can arise from using our skills. Keeping in mind that some situations may not be right for you to eye gouge and rip people to shreds, but they might be a situation that requires you to restrain and control an individual. It is in those situations that you better have good Judo and grappling skills outside of basic wrist locks and major chokes.

"Handling a grappler".... don't stop there think about how to handle all types of fighters and be ready for everything that can be thrown at you! How's your boxing? ;)



www.lovelandmartialarts.com
5th Degree Kajukenbo and Kodokan Judo,  also teaching Kickboxing and Royce Gracie Jiu Jitsu.