Author Topic: Your on your own  (Read 23875 times)

Offline sifutimg

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #45 on: January 16, 2008, 01:47:39 AM »
That's why I train.  Until the population stops being stupid on each other there has to those folks who try to be there for one another.  I appreciate our armed forces (thank you those here on this forum who have served), I appreciate all my teachers who have yelled at me to do it over and over again, and I appreciate all my training brothers and sisters who work to kick my asp so I understand.  I was livid watching that video.  As Professor Bono pointed out one good kick to the head that that guy would have been laid out, I mean crap!  The more we share our art the better place we all make it.

My 2cents,
Tim
Grandmaster Tim Gagnier
Student of Great Grandmaster Charles Gaylord & Grandmaster Sid Lopez
Chief Instructor Pacific Wind Kajukenbo
Student Forever
Yamhill, Oregon

allen73

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #46 on: January 16, 2008, 03:50:24 AM »
I use to train with Sifu Dusty Rhodes, a great guy I just found his teaching methods to be questionable. Currently I'm training in Muay Thai and Sayoc Kali. Kajukenbo is  kind of hard to find around here. But to be honest James I like your response. See how you felt watching a person almost get killed and someone was just video taping. And how the rest of the people were lame in their attempts to stop it. Pissed you off didn't it?  I don't know Prof. Bono I would have used a nice shin kick to the side of the face or maybe a tire iron or maybe a cricket stick it is Europe after all.

Offline KajuJKDFighter

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #47 on: January 16, 2008, 08:19:56 AM »
I'm a nice guy to.....some say.....some maybe not.......but still they guy needed to be asleep then arrested then in jail for life......
GM John E Bono DC
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Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline NYKaju

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #48 on: January 16, 2008, 08:39:23 AM »
I use to train with Sifu Dusty Rhodes, a great guy I just found his teaching methods to be questionable. Currently I'm training in Muay Thai and Sayoc Kali. Kajukenbo is  kind of hard to find around here. But to be honest James I like your response. See how you felt watching a person almost get killed and someone was just video taping. And how the rest of the people were lame in their attempts to stop it. Pissed you off didn't it?  I don't know Prof. Bono I would have used a nice shin kick to the side of the face or maybe a tire iron or maybe a cricket stick it is Europe after all.

Yes I was disgusted and angry watching that. Is that the kind of reaction you were looking for? Because I can't imagine anyone not feeling that way after watching that. I think upon seeing that -assuming I was there- I'd be overcome with adrenaline and a need to stop what I witnessing, that I'm not quite sure if I'd be able to restrain myself enough to stop myself. I can't imagine what's going through those guys heads who kept kicking him in the shoulder as he just continues to stab the knife like that.

And thanks for your response. I was fairly certain you trained currently or prior with Sifu Dusty. Not the biggest state you know ;)

There's another guy in Queens I believe that I have not met yet, but if you were interested in training again I'll let you know what he's like once I do. Also, I'll send you a message the next time there's a throwdown in the city (good fun with open mat sparring against martial artists of all stripes and colors).
Sensei/Coach James Mayors
Ronin Martial Arts
Kajukenbo under Dan Tyrrell
BJJ under Matt Serra
Judo under Mark Staniszewski
"You don't rise to the level of your expectations, you fall to the level of your training"

LOYALONEHK

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #49 on: January 16, 2008, 09:00:10 AM »
I use to train with Sifu Dusty Rhodes, a great guy I just found his teaching methods to be questionable. Currently I'm training in Muay Thai and Sayoc Kali. Kajukenbo is  kind of hard to find around here. But to be honest James I like your response. See how you felt watching a person almost get killed and someone was just video taping. And how the rest of the people were lame in their attempts to stop it. Pissed you off didn't it?  I don't know Prof. Bono I would have used a nice shin kick to the side of the face or maybe a tire iron or maybe a cricket stick it is Europe after all.

Yes I was disgusted and angry watching that. Is that the kind of reaction you were looking for? Because I can't imagine anyone not feeling that way after watching that. I think upon seeing that -assuming I was there- I'd be overcome with adrenaline and a need to stop what I witnessing, that I'm not quite sure if I'd be able to restrain myself enough to stop myself. I can't imagine what's going through those guys heads who kept kicking him in the shoulder as he just continues to stab the knife like that.

And thanks for your response. I was fairly certain you trained currently or prior with Sifu Dusty. Not the biggest state you know ;)

There's another guy in Queens I believe that I have not met yet, but if you were interested in training again I'll let you know what he's like once I do. Also, I'll send you a message the next time there's a throwdown in the city (good fun with open mat sparring against martial artists of all stripes and colors).

Check this out James and Allen:
http://www.estacada.net/index.html

http://www.estacada.net/history.htm

Maybe close enough, but if not, well worth the drive. 

Respectfuly,
Dean

Sifu Bill falls under GM Vince Black and Tom Bisio on the family tree.  Wealth of knowledge there...   8)

Offline NYKaju

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #50 on: January 16, 2008, 09:07:56 AM »
Thanks brother Dean! Yep, that's the guy I was talking about, but this is the website I found him on.. http://www.themartialartsstudio.com/

I believe it's the same place, just one site is promoting the Estacada in particular. Thanks for the link!
Sensei/Coach James Mayors
Ronin Martial Arts
Kajukenbo under Dan Tyrrell
BJJ under Matt Serra
Judo under Mark Staniszewski
"You don't rise to the level of your expectations, you fall to the level of your training"

LOYALONEHK

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #51 on: January 16, 2008, 09:17:37 AM »
If I was living in NYC Sifu Bill's #2 on my list of instructors to seek out.   8)

Offline NYKaju

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #52 on: January 16, 2008, 09:27:31 AM »
If I was living in NYC Sifu Bill's #2 on my list of instructors to seek out.   8)

aww shucks...did I really make #1 on your list? I'm getting embarrassed now  :)
Sensei/Coach James Mayors
Ronin Martial Arts
Kajukenbo under Dan Tyrrell
BJJ under Matt Serra
Judo under Mark Staniszewski
"You don't rise to the level of your expectations, you fall to the level of your training"

LOYALONEHK

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #53 on: January 16, 2008, 09:34:21 AM »
If I was living in NYC Sifu Bill's #2 on my list of instructors to seek out.   8)

aww shucks...did I really make #1 on your list? I'm getting embarrassed now  :)

Pride before a fall my son...  Pride before a fall.  ;)

I'd have to seek out Tom Bisio first...  but then I am really into the TCM side of things these days.   8)

Have a good day youngen  :-*

but I digress...  back to "Your on your own"
« Last Edit: January 16, 2008, 09:36:02 AM by KajuPit Corpsman »

Offline Gints Klimanis

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #54 on: January 16, 2008, 10:25:21 AM »
As Professor Bono pointed out one good kick to the head that that guy would have been laid out, I mean crap!  The more we share our art the better place we all make it.

True.  It does appear as if the on-lookers were trying to stop him despite their fear that the knifer wiill turn on them.  Still, you'd think that any European nation would have enough soccer players to deliver a kick to the head from a distance.
"We do not condone the use of a toilet seat as a deadly weapon"
Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo, 3rd Degree Black Belt Prof. Richard Lewis
Bono JKD/Kajukenbo, Prof. John Bono, San Jose, CA
Baltic Dog, Dog Brothers Martial Arts

Offline Gints Klimanis

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #55 on: January 16, 2008, 10:36:07 AM »
Yes I was disgusted and angry watching that. Is that the kind of reaction you were looking for? Because I can't imagine anyone not feeling that way after watching that. I think upon seeing that -assuming I was there- I'd be overcome with adrenaline and a need to stop what I witnessing, that I'm not quite sure if I'd be able to restrain myself enough to stop myself. I can't imagine what's going through those guys heads who kept kicking him in the shoulder as he just continues to stab the knife like that.

It's difficult to predict our reactions.  I know that my wife likes to cheer for UFC and pride fighters on TV.  However, when one is in trouble, she cringes.  And that's TV.    When you see a one-sided fight, why doesn't someone step in to stop it?  I think people are just shocked by the moment.   Although I have next to zero emergency medial training, I do remember in some courses that if help is needed, a finger point and direct command is what is needed to mobilize any onlooker.
As Internet video viewers, we can only fantasize what we would do in a particular situation.   It's not much different than the arm-chair quarterback syndrome.
I'm sure that most of us would freeze in the moment when we are needed.  A lot of real experience is needed, and the dojo doesn't provide that.

I watch a lot of first-time knife sparrers.  And yes, it's not a real knife fight.  That's exactly the point.  Even when "trained" martial artists are set up to fight with fake blades for 60 seconds, first timers freeze up and usually drop the blade within 15 seconds.   I think that is a window into real human behavior under the stress of a fight.










"We do not condone the use of a toilet seat as a deadly weapon"
Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo, 3rd Degree Black Belt Prof. Richard Lewis
Bono JKD/Kajukenbo, Prof. John Bono, San Jose, CA
Baltic Dog, Dog Brothers Martial Arts

Offline KajuJKDFighter

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #56 on: January 16, 2008, 11:04:08 AM »
I think a lot depends on what you have seen before and your training to that point. It was a small blade and his focus was on the ex so someone should have had the guts to as you said soccer him.....
GM John E Bono DC
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Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline rockatear

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #57 on: January 16, 2008, 12:06:13 PM »
It's difficult to predict our reactions.  I know that my wife likes to cheer for UFC and pride fighters on TV.  However, when one is in trouble, she cringes.  And that's TV.    When you see a one-sided fight, why doesn't someone step in to stop it?  I think people are just shocked by the moment.   Although I have next to zero emergency medial training, I do remember in some courses that if help is needed, a finger point and direct command is what is needed to mobilize any onlooker.
As Internet video viewers, we can only fantasize what we would do in a particular situation.   It's not much different than the arm-chair quarterback syndrome.
I'm sure that most of us would freeze in the moment when we are needed.  A lot of real experience is needed, and the dojo doesn't provide that.

Sifu Gints,

I've seen little kids with bigger guts then those folks that were standing around or attempting to kick the attacker. When you say "I'm sure most of us..." are you talking the general population or those of us here on the Cafe regardless of our experience in our training? I can say without a doubt that in that video situation I would've taken action to stop him even without the 6 classes of knife training I've taken so far.

As an aside, I think at the very end of the clip, there is a back side profile of a man with a stun gun in his hand and he's wearing a black jacket with some kind of yellow logo on the side of that same arm and I was wondering if he wasn't part of some security. Nonetheless, he didn't do anything either.

with respect,
Shirley Phelps, blue blelt, Hand to Hand Kajukenbo Self-Defense Center, Oakland, CA, www.handtohandkajukenbo.com, Gaylord Method, Chief Head Instructors:  Sifus Jen Resnick and Sonya Richardson

Offline Gints Klimanis

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #58 on: January 16, 2008, 12:26:45 PM »
I think a lot depends on what you have seen before and your training to that point. It was a small blade and his focus was on the ex so someone should have had the guts to as you said soccer him.....

Totally agreed.  Though, I think most "training" isn't really training.   As they say, 10 years of experience is often one year of experience repeated ten times.

Soccer him.  That's funny.   There is something fishy about the video.  How can someone have a video of the entire episode.  It seems as if it was taken the viewpoint of a car on the street.

"We do not condone the use of a toilet seat as a deadly weapon"
Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo, 3rd Degree Black Belt Prof. Richard Lewis
Bono JKD/Kajukenbo, Prof. John Bono, San Jose, CA
Baltic Dog, Dog Brothers Martial Arts

Offline Gints Klimanis

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Re: Your on your own
« Reply #59 on: January 16, 2008, 01:00:33 PM »
I've seen little kids with bigger guts then those folks that were standing around or attempting to kick the attacker. When you say "I'm sure most of us..." are you talking the general population or those of us here on the Cafe regardless of our experience in our training? I can say without a doubt that in that video situation I would've taken action to stop him even without the 6 classes of knife training I've taken so far.


Hello Shirley,

I should be more careful with my wording.  I did actually mean the general population, although I do think that most martial artists fall in this category as well, even those that think they're tough after two months of training.  The dojo training doesn't actually overcome the "freeze" or even the decision-making process on whether to intervene, watch or run away.  We've covered discussions on the "heart" of a fighter, and I believe the conclusion was that training only enhances a quality that was always there but can't be added.  Whether that's true instinct or early development is still unknown. 

Gints
"We do not condone the use of a toilet seat as a deadly weapon"
Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo, 3rd Degree Black Belt Prof. Richard Lewis
Bono JKD/Kajukenbo, Prof. John Bono, San Jose, CA
Baltic Dog, Dog Brothers Martial Arts