Surprise additional costs and clubs?

[badsifu]

There was an article I read just a little while ago that had a different spin on the whole (insert color here) Belt Club idea.  The person said ok, you are registering for this belt club.  It is this much per month, for this many months.  If you aren't to that level yet, there is no additional charges after that point until you received your rank.

Now, if the instructor was honest and presented quality material and students, then I would have to think that the particular club would be beneficial to the student - and the school.  

I notice that many people here say they charge for belt tests.  Why is that?

[John Bishop]

I charge for belt tests because I buy the belt, print out the certificates, give the student thier patch (after their 1st belt test).  

[Karazenpo]

Agreed, Badsifu but as you know in many cases that is not true and some of the prices are way out of line and the quality of instruction is in question especially after they get your money.
  Test registration fees?  A  vast majority of the schools I have known of over the last 30 years have had them. Some, however, waver for black belt.  I can't speak for others but my reason is to help absorb rising overhead costs and still keep the monthly tuition at a very affordable rate, same reason for purchasing gis and other equipment soley through the studio. However, I let both students and/or parents know when they sign up and I also have it clearly posted in the school what I just stated with the addition of to not confuse this with "buying" your belt and I go on that the test reg. fee does not influence the instructors to put someone undeserving up for rank in any way, shape or form. I further state I would not compromise my values or insult the integrity of my instructor in doing so.  The reason for the explaination: you know how there is always someone not into the arts that will probably say to a student (out of jealousy or insecurity), that they bought their belt. This way my student will be prepared to answer them back. I also have a sign in my schools that I  had actually copied from Grandmaster George Pesare back in the 70's that reads: If you are more interested in wearing a belt than earning one, I suggest you study somewhere else. That's the first thing a prospect sees when he opens the hallway door to the school. I think that says it all!

[Sifu Terry McBride]

Same here on the test fees.  It helps cover the cost and helps me keep my doors open.  I have a nice, really nice dojo.  I want it to suceed but certainly without jepordizing what Kajukenbo is.  My students "earn" their belts, they are not given to them because a fee was made and I make that clear to them.  Test fees in other arts have been around for awhile, some of them are really high (outrageous in my opnion).  I haven't had any complaints, I'm in business and have to look at it in a way to be profitable.

[Karazenpo]

Yeah Terry, we're on the same page. I also tell them they are investing their time and effort at the school and there is nothing worse than doing so and coming to class one day and finding a sign on the door, "Closed-Out of Business". This way it shows an influx of monies into the school to assure its continuing existence which is a benefit to both-student & instructor! I think I read this once in Black Belt magazine.

[Jon Pack]

Fee schedule at our school is as follows.
Introductory Program $49 includes private lessons to ready students for group structure (covers basics, rules, etiquitte and how to wear the uniform) includes uniform.
Registration fee $40 each/$80 max family(one time only).
Group lessons monthly $59 or six months $295. Private lessons monthly (4) $100 or six months (26) $550.
Other fees include test fees, seminars,clinics and proshop sales. All costs are discussed in the sign up process.
The registration fees help to keep the monthly costs down. Test fees cover cost of belts, certificates, instructor and school time.
We have a very nice school with 900+sq. feet of Swain mats and an additional 400+Sq. feet of hardwood flooring.
No clubs except my Mizuno Blades.
Thanks to all for sharing,
Jon Pack
Chippewa Valley Kempo

[Mell]

As previously stated by another student from our school.  Our belt testing fee is $15 for every rank.  It covers the cost of the belt, the certificate and the utility expense for opening the school for additional time.  If a student does not pass for any reason, the fee is refunded.

Several schools in our area charge higher and higher fees for each rank, going to astronomical rates for black belt testing.  When you have students commit years of time to your school and years of time to the system, is that how they should be repaid  - with a $400 testing fee?

Students who are brown and black belts should be assisting with instuction so as to help them progress and grow in training others.  (We begin to understand things more clearly when we as students have to learn how to explain concepts to other students).  Brown and black belts should not be paying monthly dues - they should be helping/assisting in the school in exchange for their training.  Just my opinion.

[John Erickson]

Mell,

I disagree that a brown or black belt should not have to pay for tuition in exchange for assisting.  I feel that when assisting/ teaching, a person begins to develop a better understanding of their art.  So, if my instructor allows me to assist, I think that I am benefitting from the experience as much or more than he or the students.  I'm still glad to pay tuition so that the school may prosper.  If you are talking about a full time instructor, (still a student under the chief instructor)who teaches his own classes, that may be different.

Respectfully,

John

P.S.  To reply to the original thread, I think that whatever a school's financial policies/ contracts consist of, there should be NO HIDDEN COSTS.  That is bad business in my opinion.  Let's face it though, for some schools,  business is their highest priority.  Quality martial arts instruction and financial success does not have to be mutually exclusive.

[sig666+]

No matter were you go you will be charge a fee
If is a low or a high fee, the best way two know in what you are getting in,  Is by reading every thing possible first, Talk two old members, go two the class for some time before joining it, ask lots of questions to every one check for how long this school has been in business, how many black belt are been promoted most of all check for Teachers Certifications and Associations, and take the contract too or talk to a Attorney for the so call contract before you sign.

good Kajukenbo business school normally charge between $45.00 too $70.00 a month
Test for belt about $15.00 too $55.00
anything extra will be to much (But hey is your money)

The teacher most first respect the student so that the student can respect the teacher  

[badsifu]

The local Taekwondo 2nd degree instructors here in town charge $85 for 2 days a week of training + test fees.  Which means I am worth about....well, first born sound about right?  

No testing fees.  $100 a month, all the classes (6 days a week) and weight room included.  I guess you get what you pay for these days, but to put a blanket amount may be a less than accurate way of measuring what you are really receiving.

1)  Who teaches the classes?  The Owner/Head Instructor, a High Ranking Black Belt, an Enthusiastic 1st-3rd degree instructor, the 15 year old kid who just got his Brown Belt?

2)  Does the teaching style of the instructor fit your needs

3)  Has the school been around a while?  Are you gonna get stuck with a blue belt from someone who up and leaves cause they can't pay the rent anymore?

I have always felt that the tuition never was in fair trade for the instruction.  The student pays the bills, and takes care of the instructor's living needs so the instructor can continue to teach his/her art.  However, even after that time, the student hasn't paid his debt to his/her instructor.

When I first started teaching on my own, I got that John Graden book and poured through it.  Some of which I still use, some I thought was just junk.  The one thing I did like was what he felt about his worth as a black belt.  What is the value of what you have learned?  Would you trade in your martial arts experience for $1000?  $100,000  $1,000,000???  Most would say no to all 3.

[Mell]

I see from my last post that some of you may not agree with the thought of students (Black Belts) who are assisting with instructing no longer being charged monthly dues.  I'm not talking about helping with one or two classes here or there.   (I assist with 7 classes every week and train during 2 classes).  

Though I personally no longer pay dues to my instructor, by his request, I still support the school financially in the purchase of everyday items we need as well as equipment gifts.

So I know if we are just "out there", does anyone else have the same practice?

[Enfemus]

I feel the same pain on this one, It's like seminar here, testing fee there, but I think in the end the knowledge we are learning is Priceless. I just wish up front I would have known more about the fees.