Author Topic: Black Belt Expiration Dates:  (Read 6845 times)

C-Kaju Dog

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Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« on: February 15, 2010, 11:35:35 AM »
Just wondering if anyone puts or has thought of putting expiration dates on BB certificates?

I have not done it, but can think of some good reasons to do so.

Im thinking of putting expiration dates on all certs up to 3rd degree black.

What say you?

Offline Claudio

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2010, 12:12:32 PM »

Are you looking at inactivity and if so how long of a break would constitute a removal of rank.
What is the criteria for the expiration date.?
Prof. Claude "Claudio" Lawson III
Ronin Kombat Systems / American Kajukembo Assoc

Kajukembo/Kajukenbo(GM Davis)/ Brazilian Jiujitsu/Kick Boxing/ Practical Weapons/ JKD

Offline Ghost Rider

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2010, 12:33:37 PM »
I have never heard of anyone doing that.
My personal opinion is that once you earn a certificate it should not be taken away do to an expiration date.
Not everyone makes martial arts a life time journey.
Some people start training with the only goal being to get their black belt.
They should receive credit for what they have accomplished.
They should not have it revoked because they decide to move on to something else in their life.

There are many reasons to revoke a certificate but I do not think expiration dates should be one of them.
That sounds more like a way of forcing them to continue training with you.
Just your Kajudads opinion
Greg Harper
Greg Harper
senior instructor, Gumataotao Kajukenbo
Head instructor, Kajupit MMA
Sijo Emperado's personal body guard

Offline kfarny

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2010, 12:37:06 PM »
Aren't they kind of "self-expiring" anyway? If you go to a different school they recognize that you have a black belt, but not necessacarily in their system, so you are forced to essentially start over. If you stop going to your original school and then go back, you can't promote until you come back up to speed. (Most schools I have heard of anyway.)
Kirk Farnsworth   3rd Degree,  East/West Method Tum Pai
East West Martial Arts, Master Doug Bertrand
Vancouver, Wa.

Offline KajuJKDFighter

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2010, 01:05:26 PM »
I think  Black Belt cert is like a college degree once you earn it it's yours....
GM John E Bono DC
9th Degree Grand Master Gaylord Method Kajukenbo
Full Instructor-Hartsell's Jeet Kune Do Grappling Assoc
Chief Instructor Bono's Jeet Kune Do/Kajukenbo
Champions aren't made in the gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them a desire,a dream,a vision

Offline Ron Baker

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2010, 01:24:01 PM »
Sifu Dean,

I'm assuming that you're talking about making the certification "inactive" after a certain period of time? 

I can see upside and downside.  Upside is that you know your BB has kept up his/her knowledge; has been training/teaching regularly.  Downside is that it might create a gray area as to what it takes to become active again. 

Good topic, though. 
Sigung (Shihan) Ron Baker
Kajukenbo 5280 MMA Foundation
Under GM Jason Groff
Ordonez Kajukenbo Ohana

Offline David V. Amiccuci

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2010, 02:44:44 PM »
Sifu Dean,

We have two classifications one for Black Belts and the other for Black Belt Instructors. Our Black Belts are called Mr./ Mrs. And there last name and Instructors are called Instructor and there last name.

Students at Tony Ramos Kajukenbo / Ramos Method once one earns there Black Belt they get to keep there Black Belt and certificate unless they do something that would drastically effect the Family of Tony Ramos Kajukenbo / Ramos Method and Kajukenbo Family.

 It would be something that goes against the pillars of what it takes to be a Black Belt in our Method. Honor, Bravery, Loyalty, Family. Example: Being convicted of Child Molestation, Drug Dealing, Trafficking, Abusing there Rank or Knowledge etc.

If the Instructor doesn?t keep up with his or her certification or becomes inactive his /her teaching credential and Instructorship will then be removed. The teaching credential expires yearly if not renewed.

Grand Master David V. Amiccuci
9th Deg Red/Silver Belt 9th Degree Red Silver/ Sash
Successor to GGM Ahgung Tony Ramos Kajukenbo/Ramos Method
Cacoy World Doce Pares
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7th Grade Eskrido
6th Grade Pangamot
Under SGM Cacoy Canete


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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2010, 02:48:23 PM »
Well there are"Training certificates" and "Honorary certificates", A training cert, is with the mother school, which means alot when "your" instructor feels you are worthy because of the knowledge you possess within the school you are in. That is why the importance of the the "Fifth" degree belt rank or Chief Instructor rank given by the Mother school, because of the school's personal knowledge of the Student's progression, throughout the 4-7 years of attaining the Black Belt, then tacking on the required years of each degree 1st thru 4th (another 10+) towards the 5th degree Black Belt,,,,that's alot of years watching a student grow. And IS that person deserving of that RANK, excuse the term But,,,HE_ _ YES!!! and can you take that knowledge "earned" away from them.. again HE _ _ NO!!!
The knowledge doesn't EXPIRE....It only expires if the student does not have the required time and knowledge worthy of the belt they are wearing, from lack of knowledge,school hopping,belt hopping or the $$$. That is the part of OUR history, that will and has caused ridicule from the other ARTS. Yep that is dirty laundry! But as SIJO said in the many talks "washey, washey, till it all comes clean" ;D
But it does not taint the 6TH -10TH honorary degrees or "elders" that put their life and years into furthering KAJUKENBO future. Actually it strengthens it! For they are the history that is making Kajukenbo great and the future BONAFIDE Instructors wil make US greater...
with all due respect
« Last Edit: February 15, 2010, 04:06:40 PM by GM ALAN M.REYES »
SGM Alan M. Reyes
SrGrandMaster KSDI(2014)
GrandMaster KSDI(1999)
9th DegreeRed/SilverBelt KSDI(1986)
60Yrs.ContinuousTraining KSDI/ReyesKenpoKarate(2014)
FirstGenerationStudent/Successor-GGM Aleju C. Reyes-RKK CA(1959)
FirstGenerationStudent-GGM Sijo Adriano D. Emperado-Palama Settlement Hi(1954)

Offline Danjo

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2010, 10:48:17 PM »
I think the expiration date usually has "R.I.P." after it. That way it isn't just passed on to someone else.
"Rank Without Honor is Nothing."
Dan Weston
3rd Degree Black Belt under Prof. Bishop
Don't tell me how much you honor Sijo, if you don't respect his wishes.

Offline Rick Kingi

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2010, 02:54:30 PM »
  I think it's really simple, once you earn your Black Belt it should be your forever and the only other subject that comes with it is degrees and if you are not active then no promotions, I don't belive any one can take your belt away from you because it all about knowledge that you have learned and no one can take that away form you...

GM Rick Kingi

Offline Patrick Campbell

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2010, 03:00:07 PM »
Once you earn it it is yours. Having an expiration date opens up too many possible doors, most of which shouldn't be opened. Like Professor Bono said, it's like earning a college degree.

Patrick "Kaponookalani" Campbell, Ph.D.
KAJUKENBO - Professor Kai Li - ETS / HKA
Kenpo - SGM Rick Alemany 
DZR Jujitsu - ETS / AJI
BJJ - ETS / USFBJJ / Master Joe Moreira
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C-Kaju Dog

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2010, 06:20:13 PM »
Ok, thank you for the feedback.

Chock that idea to the circle file.

Good points by all, I just thought stop in for a cup-o-kaju.


Offline Sigung Jeff Macalolooy

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2010, 11:08:13 PM »
haven't been on the kajucafe for a while, but think this is an interesting topic ...

i say no on a black belt expiration .... but yes on an instructors certificate ... i'm a teacher (currently 6th grade pe; i've also taught 7th & 8th grade science, math, and pe) and we have to re-new our teaching credential periodically with continuing education ... i think the same is good for marital artist ... we are evolving and so should our knowledge and teaching methods ...

i have an associate instructors certificate from grandmaster richard bustillo in jkd that expires every 3 years, i have to continue my training with him in order to renew it ... he holds instructor's conferences a few time a year which consist of 1 week of training with various instructors 6-9hours/day ... at first i thought it was odd to see an expiration date ... but after thinking about it ... its just continuing education ... and like gm ted sotelo always tells me ... student first, teacher second

just my humble opinion
Jeff Macalolooy
Focus on the future.

Offline grand master hemenes

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Re: Black Belt Expiration Dates:
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2010, 01:27:27 PM »
this is the way i ran my classes for thirty years and i never changed these days
mon-tues froms grab arts ect. wed-thr sparing fri. open night  sat open class some students that did not want to spar and they just wanted to do forms they could come on those nights and i had students that did not want to do forms all they wanted was to spar so they only came on those nights but they had option of what day they wanted. and most of my students came to all the classes and i had over 400 students at the time. and i have to agree with harper on one point a lot of top kata people cant fight at all its funny to see them try. and i use to get mad when they would be out there judgeing fights when they cant fight them selfs. my self i use to be one of the top kata guys around in the 80s but i also have a lot of fighting grands to and could put the gloves on with anybody. and thats what makes a true martial artist one that can do all. and if anybody thinks if you get into a fight and your going to start doing a kata on them well!! the katas are the foundation to start from then you build from that. but thats just my opinion and ive been in the martial arts for 40 years!!

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