Author Topic: Lack of power and movement in training  (Read 16397 times)

Offline Patrick Campbell

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #30 on: August 08, 2011, 06:45:07 AM »
Last night we had 2 brawls at the night club.
First one 4 guys jumped 1 of my bouncers, I dropped 1 with a single punch and then pinned him to the floor with a knee and a thumb strike to stomach 9, another bouncer came over and held him down so I could help my bouncer who had 1 guy down and 2 on his back punching him.
I went to his aid and dropped another with a punch and hit the other with a back knuckle.
Then took the guy on the floor and stood him up.
He still would not settle down so I put a choke on him and he was asleep in a few seconds.
I dropped him to the floor and started looking for a new victim, but by that time nobody else wanted any.
Billy Evangelista, who is a strike force fighter with a 11 / 1 record was right there watching the whole thing, he came up to me later and said he had never seen anything like that.
At the end of the night we had another brawl with around 20 guys.,
Just trying to keep people back I put 4 different guys on their butt with open hand strikes to the chest just below the throat and took another one out with a choke.
There was nothing fancy about any of it, just power, speed, correct angles and basic strikes.
And a little experience.
I was lucky through all of it not 1 person put a hand on me.
I’m not bragging here, just bringing to the table that I know what I’m talking about when it comes to real fighting and what will work and what will not.
Pity pat strikes and no movement would have got me hurt. 
Not a bad night for an old guy.   


Sounds like a great job to get some real practice in!

pat
Patrick "Kaponookalani" Campbell, Ph.D.
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Offline Ghost Rider

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #31 on: August 08, 2011, 11:36:04 AM »
We have a very mature team of the 23 in house there are 10 that are Kajukenbo some with about a year with us and some with over 20 years with me.
And another 5 that have a long martial arts background other than Kajukenbo.
(So 15 out of the 23 are trained in martial arts)
4 of the others are 375 to 400 pounds (not fat)
The outside guys are mostly just parking lot security and pat down for our doors.
(Two of the outside guys are Kajukenbo as well)
We are very careful and observant at all times; we are always watching each other and the crowd.
I terminate anyone who does not scan at all times.
Anything can happen at any time.
Many, including performers and promoters say that we have the best security team they have ever seen.
But that doesn’t mean we can’t be hurt and we know it.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2011, 11:39:37 AM by Ghost Rider »
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Offline jcordova

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #32 on: August 09, 2011, 11:32:33 PM »
Good that you have people that th know and trust.  Be very careful and always watch your six.
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Offline Danjo

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #33 on: August 10, 2011, 01:51:38 AM »
We have a very mature team of the 23 in house there are 10 that are Kajukenbo some with about a year with us and some with over 20 years with me.
And another 5 that have a long martial arts background other than Kajukenbo.
(So 15 out of the 23 are trained in martial arts)
4 of the others are 375 to 400 pounds (not fat)
The outside guys are mostly just parking lot security and pat down for our doors.
(Two of the outside guys are Kajukenbo as well)
We are very careful and observant at all times; we are always watching each other and the crowd.
I terminate anyone who does not scan at all times.
Anything can happen at any time.
Many, including performers and promoters say that we have the best security team they have ever seen.
But that doesn’t mean we can’t be hurt and we know it.


I'll be honest, I always think it's cool to hear real world uses of Kajukenbo. A lot of things will pass for a martial art until you have to get in a fight.
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Offline John Bishop

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #34 on: September 04, 2011, 03:37:18 PM »
Here's a good example of lack of power.  The guard had good movement, good defenses, stayed up on his feet.  But in the end the attacker, who was smaller then him looked like he hadn't even been in a fight. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_7fIYPzeFg&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Your thoughts?
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Offline KajuJKDFighter

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #35 on: September 04, 2011, 05:30:10 PM »
Power is hard to determine by video...a pro fighter can take and give a punch harder then it seems to appear...maybe they were hard hits but the other guy just had a tough head...you just never know....Guys like Micky Ward for example could take punches and make it look like the opponent had no power when they did....the thug guy had some pretty good knots on his forehead for sure...
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Offline Aloha Aina

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #36 on: September 05, 2011, 03:46:18 AM »
I think a good tought is: Fight like in a ring in the streets vs. Use of Self Defense Techniques like Kajukenbo.

And if the civilian guy had a knife and pulled it in a conceled way?...I think that Guard that Fought well was going to be wasted...


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Offline KajuJKDFighter

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #37 on: September 05, 2011, 04:25:07 AM »
But if we start using what ifs in a fight, what if the guard had a knife or a gun....
......you can always add what ifs....
« Last Edit: September 05, 2011, 04:27:34 AM by KajuJKDFighter »
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Offline jcordova

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #38 on: September 05, 2011, 09:30:55 AM »
Looks to me  the bad guy was on drugs, though the guard did great in defending himself.
Sifu Jesus Cordova, 4th Degree
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Offline Greg Hoyt

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #39 on: September 05, 2011, 10:23:37 AM »
Yes, I think the guard did good.  Way too long a fight, though. 
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Offline Aloha Aina

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #40 on: September 05, 2011, 01:39:10 PM »
Just trying to understand your opinion about the forms of defense...for me the self defense works better in this situations rather then Kick/muay thay...less involving I mean...both ways can work fine, but were suposed to work self defense and for me this could be dealt better with kajukenbo...
I think the guy could be on drugs also...

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Offline Jason Goldsmith

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #41 on: September 05, 2011, 02:06:16 PM »
A lot of self-defenses I see, including in Kajukenbo, are overly fancy and just don't pass the sniff test for working in a real fight, whether it be in the street or the cage.  A nice kick to the side of the knee (a staple of muy thai) works everywhere.  Same thing regarding a punch to the face.  Good solid fundamentals that have been drilled against resisting opponents over and over again is what people need; not 12-hit combos with lots of hammer fists and a fancy leg sweep that will never work against someone resisting. 
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Offline KajuJKDFighter

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #42 on: September 05, 2011, 02:37:04 PM »
A fight is a fight...each brings there own skill, the guard had a skill set that wasn't a street skill set to me but was much better then no training......a round kick to the side of the knee rarely ends a fight, to the side of the thigh may though....I have been teaching leg kicks for a couple decades and in reality accuracy is the key.

I think the guard was practicing...he "sparred" the guy as opposed to fighting him....but that may have been his intent.... I have done it, I'm sure many on here have also
...as you get older and less concerned with the playing part of the fight, you tend to try to end it fast and early and go home....but there has to be that skill set present...
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Offline Jason Goldsmith

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #43 on: September 05, 2011, 03:49:14 PM »
I completely agree; my thought is that not all skill sets are equal.  People who train fancy ten-hit counters against a single punch with resistance have a much less useful skill set than a professional fighter, for example, who trains against resisting opponents daily. 
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Offline Rev. Brian Henderson

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Re: Lack of power and movement in training
« Reply #44 on: September 05, 2011, 06:29:47 PM »
After a 30 year career in law enforcement (the last 23 years in the Border Patrol) I think I may know why the security guard did not finish off the thug.  It isn't that he couldn't it is that he wouldn't.  Let me explain.  Number one, there were no "friends" of the thug hanging arround, so there was no threat of a gang bang beat down.  Number two, there were no weapons involved, so excessive force would have been problematic from a Monday morning quarter back analysis, both by his employer and lawyers.  Remember that he is not a police officer and he probably would not be protected by the Security comapies legal team.  Number three, in this ecconomy people loose their jobs at the drop of a hat, and new jobs are hard to come by.  Plain and simple it was safer to fend him off with superior skill than finish him off and suffer the possible ramifications.

I am sad to say that this is also the way a lot of cops think today.  Since the Rodney King episode in LA (I was patrolling there during the riots), most law enforcement officers are just as concerned about what happens after a physical encounter as they are concerned about what happens during it.  This causes many officers to react slower and with less confidence.  But I guess that's unrelated to this issue.
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